Posts by Life is now

2

Jupiter - Ayaka Hirahara

by possible-san in

jupiter - ayaka hirahara.

this is the music which arranged classical music.. ayaka hirahara is a famous japanese singer.. http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=g_lxczt2g6m.

english version is here.. http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=4m9p83icdoo.

Demons!

by wildflowermeadow in

jws are obsessed with demons.

do you have any evidence spirits exist?

what about magic?

What accusations do you have about us JWs? AND what group are YOU a part of?

by theMadJW in

.

i'm one of the few jws that freely admit our faults and mistakes.. let's compare notes!.

I have already put the last nails in the coffin of my beliefs in Jehovah's Witnesses doctrines. It has been obvious to me for a long time that the governing body are not the exclusively spirit directed group that they claim to be and it gets more and more glaringly obvious each piece of their literature I read.

BUT, emotionally I couldn't let go completely until two nights ago I downloaded, from Commentary Press, Crisis of Conscience. I read it through the night and went to bed at 4 am feeling much freer and relieved.

Paulapollos, I've found all your posts extremely helpful and I can't find the words to express my appreciation for your comment today helping me to break free.

56

Since Leaving "The Truth" Are You Really Happier?

by minimus in

jw
friends

witnesses say that when people leave "the truth", they get involved in a debauched life, misery, and general unhappiness.. they give experiences of some that left the "sweet fellowship" of the "brotherhood" and the awful results because of it.

then, they come back and their lives change 100% for the better!.

have you found life to be miserable and unproductive since "leaving jehovah"?.

Life is now

I'm not completely out yet, but just having the freedom to choose for myself such things as loving unconditionally is bringing me many blessings.

Having overcome tremendous obstacles I am no longer fearful of any challenges and being relieved of all that fear and judgment is leaving me free to enjoy the beautiful things in life.

I thought I was happy before but now I am truly happy. This for me is the real life.

13

Relationship with god, what is it really?

by highdose in

jw
friends

in this thread i'm speaking as a atheist who used to be comended for her close realtionship with jehovah.

i realised that he dosn't exsist about a year and a bit ago.

so who or what did i have a realtionship with?

Life is now

I agree with Mad Sweeney. Well put.

I no longer believe there could be such a person as a god of love who could also be a god of vengeance, and even if there was such a god I certainly do not want to worship him.

On the other hand, a belief in having something, whether it comes from outside of us or inside of us such as a higher self, that we can tap into to be comforted and/or empowered can be valuable. That is the path I have been exploring recently and I've found hidden strengths I never knew I had.

42

No I don't believe anyone here has been permanently warped by the Borg any more than your parents could do the same to you.

by gubberningbody in

jw
friends

you are who you are so much more due to your own peculiar genetic inheritance, and this is what eventually prevails.. there was a longitudinal study i read a number of years ago that tested the idea that we all have inborn "happiness setpoints".

these people in the study were followed through 20-25 years and periodically examined as regards their self-reported measures of happiness.

the finding was that no matter what happened either positively or negatively in their lives, within 8-12 weeks they were universally back to their baseline.. this means a couple of things:.

Life is now

Here is what Baroness Professor Dr Susan Greenfield, a neuro scientist, has to say about this:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=d44tfuq7KOc&feature=related

Dr Greenfield shows how nurture can trump nature.

It also helps us to understand how cults can control us.

40

A serious question for Christians and Non-Christians: How Can Love Hate?

by sabastious in

1 john 4:2 - whoever does not love does not know god, because god is love.. .

what does the statement "god is love" mean?

well quite simply that god = love.

Life is now

This is the JW's explanation in the Insight book Volume 1 pages 1042 - 1044

HATE

In the Scriptures the word "hate" has several shades of meaning. It may denote intense hostility, sustained ill will often accompanied by malice. Such hate may become a consuming emotion seeking to bring harm to its object. "Hate" may also signify a strong dislike but without any intent to bring harm to the object, seeking instead to avoid it because of a feeling of loathing toward it. The Bible also employs the word "hate" to mean loving to a lesser degree. (Ge 29:31, 33; De 21:15, 16) For example, Jesus Christ said: "If anyone comes to me and does not hate his father and mother and wife and children and brothers and sisters, yes, and even his own soul, he cannot be my disciple." (Lu 14:26) Obviously Jesus did not mean that his followers were to feel hostility or loathing toward their families and toward themselves, as this would not be in agreement with the rest of the Scriptures.—Compare Mr 12:29-31; Eph 5:28, 29, 33.

God’s law to Israel stated: "You must not hate your brother in your heart." (Le 19:17) One of the requirements for one presenting himself as an unintentional manslayer and seeking to gain safety in the cities of refuge was that he had not held hatred toward the one slain.—De 19:4, 11-13.

Hate
One’sEnemies? Jesus’ counsel to love one’s enemies is in full harmony with the spirit of the Hebrew Scriptures. (Mt 5:44) Faithful Job recognized that any feeling of malicious joy over the calamity of one intensely hating him would have been wrong. (Job 31:29) The Mosaic Law enjoined upon the Israelites the responsibility to come to the aid of other Israelites whom they might view as their enemies. (Ex 23:4, 5) Instead of rejoicing over the disaster of an enemy, God’s servants are instructed: "If the one hating you is hungry, give him bread to eat; and if he is thirsty, give him water to drink."—Pr 24:17, 18; 25:21.
The idea that enemies were to be hated was one of the things added to God’s law by the Jewish teachers of tradition. Since the Law directed that the Israelites love their neighbors (Le 19:18), these teachers inferred that this implied hating their enemies. "Friend" and "neighbor" came to be viewed as applying exclusively to Jews, whereas all others were considered to be natural enemies. In the light of their traditional understanding of "neighbor" and in view of tradition that fostered enmity toward the Gentiles, it can readily be seen why they added the unauthorized words "and hate your enemy" to the statement in God’s law.—Mt 5:43.
The Christian, by contrast, is under obligation to love his enemies, that is, those who make themselves personal enemies. Such love (Gr., a·ga´pe) is not sentimentality, based on mere personal attachment, as is usually thought of, but is a moral or social love based on deliberate assent of the will as a matter of principle, duty, and propriety, sincerely seeking the other’s good according to what is right. A·ga´pe (love) transcends personal enmities, never allowing these to cause one to abandon right principles and to retaliate in kind. As to those who oppose his Christian course and persecute him, doing so in ignorance, the servant of God will even pray for such that their eyes might be opened to see the truth concerning God and His purposes.—Mt 5:44.
Proper
Hatred. Nevertheless, under certain conditions and at certain times it is proper to hate. "There is . . . a time to love and a time to hate." (Ec 3:1, 8) Even of Jehovah it is said that he hated Esau. (Mal 1:2, 3) But this cannot be attributed to any arbitrariness on God’s part. Esau proved himself unworthy of Jehovah’s love by despising his birthright and selling it and hence also the divine promises and blessings attached thereto. Moreover, he purposed to kill his brother Jacob. (Ge 25:32-34; 27:41-43; Heb 12:14-16) God also hates lofty eyes, a false tongue, hands that are shedding innocent blood, a heart fabricating hurtful schemes, feet that are in a hurry to run to badness, a false witness, anyone sending forth contentions among brothers, in fact, everyone and everything standing in complete opposition to Jehovah and his righteous laws.—Pr 6:16-19; De 16:22; Isa 61:8; Zec 8:17; Mal 2:16.
What
kindofhatredmustservantsofGod
cultivate?
In true loyalty to Jehovah, his servants hate what and whom he hates. (2Ch 19:2) "Do I not hate those who are intensely hating you, O Jehovah, and do I not feel a loathing for those revolting against you? With a complete hatred I do hate them. They have become to me real enemies." (Ps 139:21, 22) But this hate does not seek to inflict injury on others and is not synonymous with spite or malice. Rather, it finds expression in its utter abhorrence of what is wicked, avoiding what is bad and those intensely hating Jehovah. (Ro 12:9, 17, 19) Christians rightly hate those who are confirmed enemies of God, such as the Devil and his demons, as well as men who have deliberately and knowingly taken their stand against Jehovah.
While Christians have no love for those who turn the undeserved kindness of God into an excuse for loose conduct, they do not hate persons who become involved in wrongdoing but who are worthy of being shown mercy. Instead of hating the repentant wrongdoer, they hate the wicked act, yes, "even the inner garment that has been stained by the flesh."—Jude 4, 23.
Avoiding
ImproperHatred. Upon becoming Christians, persons who formerly hated one another do so no longer. (Tit 3:3) The one hating his brother is still walking in darkness, and any claim on his part to be a lover of God would really be a lie. Hatred of one’s brother is tantamount to murder.—1Jo 2:9, 11; 4:20; 3:15.
Sentimentality can cause one’s view of love and hate to get out of balance, as was apparently true of David in connection with his son Absalom. (2Sa 18:33; 19:1-6) Thus, too, "the one holding back his rod is hating his son, but the one loving him is he that does look for him with discipline."—Pr 13:24.
By respecting the privacy of others and showing loving consideration, a person can avoid unnecessarily making himself an object of hatred. Hence the advice: "Make your foot rare at the house of your fellowman, that he may not have his sufficiency of you and certainly hate you."—Pr 25:17.

40

A serious question for Christians and Non-Christians: How Can Love Hate?

by sabastious in

1 john 4:2 - whoever does not love does not know god, because god is love.. .

what does the statement "god is love" mean?

well quite simply that god = love.

Life is now

I personally do not believe a God of love could hate a person. There is no scripture in the Greek scriptures that speaks of God hating a person. The Hebrew word that is translated to hate does not mean to hate in the sense that we generally understand hate to mean.

http://www.biblicalhebrew.com/nt/lovehate.htm

'Hate your parents', Matthew 10:37, Luke 14:26

Hate your father

"If any man come to me, and hate not his father, and mother, and wife, and children, and brethren, and sisters, yea, and his own life also, he cannot be my disciple." (Luke 14:26)

Talmudim, 'students' of Jewish rabbis were taught to place their affections for their teachers higher than that for their fathers, for:

"his teacher has priority, for his father brought him into this world, but his teacher, who has taught him wisdom, brings him into the world to come".

But 'hatred'? Surely that is taking loyalty to your teacher too far - even if your teacher is God in human form. For another commandment is that of honouring ones parents - which itself cannot be contradicted. Indeed, this verse in Luke has caused much anguish and pain between zealous Christian sons or daughters and their parents, who believing they were expressing their devotion to Jesus, had no regard or worse still, hatred, for their parents.

But what we have here is another Hebrew problem. Biblical Hebrew lacks the necessary language to exactly define the comparative sense, i.e., 'more than' or 'less than'. Instead it tends to express two things which may be comparatively of different degree like 'first' and 'second' as extremes such as 'first' and 'last'. In this way love and hate whilst appearing as opposites may in fact be related but lesser terms such as 'love more' and 'love less'.

"If a man have two wives, one beloved, and another hated, and they have born him children, both the beloved and the hated; and if the firstborn son be hers that was hated: Then it shall be, when he maketh his sons to inherit that which he hath, that he may not make the son of the beloved firstborn before the son of the hated, which is indeed the firstborn: But he shall acknowledge the son of the hated for the firstborn, by giving him a double portion of all that he hath: for he is the beginning of his strength; the right of the firstborn is his." (Deuteronomy 21:15-17)

A Jewish man was not allowed to abandon a 'hated' wife's son's rights of inheritance. But more than this, the Deuteronomy passage describes favouritism between two wives, not absolute love and hatred, for the man bears children by both. Hence, different Bible versions struggle with the phrase "hated" and some adopt "unloved" or "disliked", as softer phrases. However, the Hebrew word used in the second phrase is sânê' (Strong’s #8130) which in its more than 140 uses is always translated by 'hate' or by words indicating 'foe' or 'enemy'. Literal versions cannot soften the apparent invective, only an idiomatic understanding or paraphrase can explain the metaphor.

The Hebrew sânê' is the opposite of love which could mean 'non-election'. This contrast is the same in Genesis 29:31 between Leah ('hated' s e nû’âh from sânê’) and Rachel, who in the previous verse is described as "loved more than Leah", a contrast of degree not of absolute love and hate. Compare also the passages in Deuteronomy 21:15-17 above; 1 Samuel 1:5; Proverbs 30:23; 2 Samuel 19:6; and even Exodus 20:3 which speaks of preferring others gods as equivalent to hating God (cf. Matthew 6:24 on serving God and mammon, loving one and hating the other).

The Jewish midrash on Exodus describes God as hating the angels, and not just the fallen ones. It does not mean he dislikes Michael and Gabriel! It means that he chooses to give man the Torah, rather than the angels:

"By three names is this mount known: The mountain of God, Mount Horeb and Mount Sinai. . . . Why The mountain of God? (Exodus 18:5). Because it was there that God manifested His Godhead. And Sinai? Because [it was on that mount] that God showed that He hates the angels and loves mankind." (Exodus Rabbah 51.8, Soncino edition)

There is actually a Hebrew wordplay here, for Sinai sounds like the Hebrew for hate, although it begins with a different Hebrew letter and may mean 'thorny'. Similarly, Malachi speaks of God's preference for Jacob over Esau:

"... yet I loved Jacob, and I hated Esau..." (Malachi 1:2-3)

But Esau, like Ishmael instead of Isaac, was not hated absolutely, only "rejected" as the Aramaic targum (paraphrase) prefers to render it. In Aramaic sanah can mean 'to hate' and 'to separate', so the gospels could be saying separate yourselves from your parents if you want to follow me. This is a possible interpretation, but still against Jewish and biblical culture which is very supportive of family. Apart from Jesus' 'separating' and staying behind in the temple when he was younger he was a very dutiful son.

Matthew, in fact, gives the game away and here a synopsis of the gospels and a little Hebrew understanding could have answered our question from the first, for he translates as "love less" rather than "hate":

"He who loves father or mother more than Me is not worthy of Me. And he who loves son or daughter more than Me is not worthy of Me." (Matthew 10:37)

Whilst Jesus does predict division as a result of following him he does not proscribe hatred for elsewhere he upholds the precept, "honour your father and your mother" (Matthew 15:4-6, 19:17-19; Mark 7:10-13).

Jesus expressed degrees in his love. He chose 12 disciples but 3 especially he spent time with and one of these, John, is called the one that Jesus loved (John 13:23; 20:2; 21:7,20). Jesus also had a special place in his heart for Martha, Lazarus and family (John 11:5).

Even if one were to take this 'hating' verse literally, a semantic twist would have you back where you started. For, Jesus tells us that our enemies will be the members of our own family, yet we are also taught, "love your enemies"! (Matthew 5:44; Luke 6:27,35)

7

Did you feel "something is wrong here" when you studied with JW?

by Albert Einstein in

jw
friends

i started to study with jw when i was 19. my jw teacher was 30+ charismatic nice guy, comming with his wife.

when discussing "bad associations" i disagreed on completely avoiding company of worldly colleauges and friends.

the sister after several atempts to convince me got angry and told me: "does it encourage you to serve jehovah?

Life is now

Yes and stopped the study, only to be persuaded to start again. A lot of things didn't make sense but having someone enthusiastic about the scriptures and telling us to always check everything, we trusted and were hooked. It's hard to believe that we could have been so taken in.

16

God's Love book - Prologue examined

by Mad Sweeney in

eventually i would like to do a deconstruction on the entire book but for now, lets start with the prologue, which claims to be written by the governing body of jehovah's witnesses.

if anyone feels this is useful, please let me know.

] in your life and thus keep yourself in gods love .

Life is now

When this book first came out, I thought at last we may have something about real love.

1st Chapter par 14 "He (God) would never ask us to carry such heavy burdens..." par 17 "Let us not forget that Jehovah is asking us to live in a way that will bring rich blessings now and lead to everlasting life in the future."

And Chapter 2 on the CONSCIENCE I thought this is great, encouraged to follow our consciences. par 20 "This book is designed to help you find that joy... Furthermore do not expect simple black and white rules on matters of conscience... Jehovah thus entrusts us with extraordinary freedom."

Then HORROR OF HORRORS Chapter 3 entitled 'LOVE THOSE WHOM GOD LOVES'. Yes it was awful and just kept getting worse chapter by chapter. I have never felt so angry and started hammering the last few nails in the coffin of my association with the so-called great GB.

I agree with ...yourmomma and Sapphy and maninthemiddle... and I think it's turned out to be the most cruel book of all.

I would be very interested in your deconstruction of the entire book ...Mad Sweeney... and if your Prologue is anthing to go by it will be very helpful indeed. Thank you.